Gruff Rhys
Drawing Rings Around The World
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NATN: Are there any plans to release the album in the States?
Gruff Rhys: Well, yeah, hopefully. We're still negotiating with a couple labels.
NATN: I know you've put out records in the past on Flydaddy, but they seem to have gone under?
GR: Yes, it's true. So we're lookin' for a new home.
NATN: So what can you tell me about the recording process and your mindset going into the new album? It's clearly different stylistically from Mwng.
GR: Well, yeah. It seems sonically, music is always behind the cinema. Like, stereo equipment was originally devised for the cinema, and music followed. And we've always been blown away by the sound in cinema. So we thought we'd make a record that could be played through that kind of system.
Coincidentally, we tried to make a film for our album Guerrilla, a couple years ago. We were going to make a film to incorporate the whole album, but it was too ambitious. So, having tried and failed in the past, we sort of learnt from our mistakes and gave songs out to different directors, to make a visual interpretation of the new album as well. It's sort of spiralled from there really. We found out there was enough space on the DVD to put remixes on, and extra songs, and galleries, and it's all connected by thirty wormholes, for which we made thirty pieces of ambient music as well. So, it's a sort of year's worth of work, really. But it's really exciting, working with so many people. All the elements, you know.
NATN: How did you choose who to farm out the films to?
GR: Well, we invited videomakers of all casts, you know. We didn't want the album to look like MTV. We tended to go for illustrators who could do it cheaply using Flash, and animate their work, and artists who like to work. Most of the people had never made a film before, or even an animation. So it's really fresh, you know. It's kind of scruffy, as well. It's not super-slick. But I suppose it's quite an eclectic album as well, so the same applies to the visuals.
NATN: You said that there's also going to be extra songs on the DVD?
GR: Yeah, [all the extra songs from the recording sessions] will be on the DVD, and you can access them through a different wormhole for the rest of the album.
NATN: So will those include b-sides?
GR: Yes, they'll make it on to CD as b-sides. Umm, and then there's about 18 remixes, done by all kinds of people, like Kid 606 and LSR, and Brave Captain, and Llwybr Llaethog. It's a bit like a pop film game, you know, getting it out in the open. It can take a few weeks, for the final fantasies.
NATN: So how do you think this record compares to your past pop records? Like, do you think it's chock full of singles, or is it something you've got to listen to all the way through to really grasp it?
GR: Um, I think some of the songs, you know, work isolated, but it's the longest album we've made. So it's less of a...with, say, Guerrilla, we were trying to create a pop express: something really instantaneous, easy to grasp, and almost disposable. And Mwng was the exact opposite in a way. But we've taken elements of both of our previous albums. We've applied the technology we used for Guerrilla, and we've applied some of the simplicity of Mwng, and of just the band playing in the studio. And we've made the arrangements this time more or less cinematic.
NATN: How does your songwriting process usually go?
GR: Well, I write a lot of songs conventionally -- on acoustic guitar and piano -- and sometimes I bring them whole to the band, and occasionally we'll jam something out as a band. Also [electronics expert] Cian [Ciaran] writes things, more like pieces of music, things like "A Touch Sensitive." And sometimes we combine, on things like "Run Christian Run" and "Alternate Route To Vulcan Street."
NATN: When you come up with something like "No Sympathy," is that something like two different pieces, one that you've written and one that Cian's, and just put them together?
GR: With that particular song, I did the first part -- the original demo -- and the end was very repetitive, it just had a kind of really fast banjo piece at the end, and Cian picked it up from there and jumped at that end and thought "I'm going to sample it all up, and mess it up there at the end," and he did. And so it makes it more of a climactic ending, to say the least.
NATN: When you got these videos back, did they all turn out like you'd hoped, or did you have a hand in editing them?
GR: Some we were appalled with, and binned right away. Scrapped. Others we thought were almost there and we re-edited them ourselves. But with most of them we were really pleased, that people had approached them with the right spirit. And we encouraged the directors to be as extreme as they wanted, and to not feel any pressure to make a music video. Umm, so they I think listened. It got really exciting when we had four or five there. Because all the artists were working for comparatively small budgets, we probably made all the films for the price of one video -- one conventional music video. Because most of them didn't spend scores on catering, etc. They had the ideas, and found where to put them.
NATN: But you did go ahead and make an actual music video for "Juxtapozed."
GR: Oh, yeah.
NATN: And do you plan to do that with the rest of the singles?
GR: Yea, I expect we'll make a music video for all of them, yeah. Because I suppose it's a different medium. It's kind of like an advert, as opposed to a pure...it has some kind of function rather than being pure art, I suppose. And it's an opportunity to work with even more people!
NATN: Would you say that in general the lyrics on Rings sort of deal more with the human condition, than say chewing gum in your hair?
GR: Possibly. I mean, the lyrics on Guerrilla were self-consciously disposable, happy. With exceptions, you know? But maybe they're just a broodier bunch of songs. And where things like "Fragile Happiness" and "Receptacle For The Respectable," you know that's about the human condition as well. Um, I suppose they're broodier and more revealing, you know?
NATN: "No Sympathy" seems pretty bleak.
GR: (Laughs)
NATN: Where does something like that come from?
GR: Well, I originally wrote it for a film, called "Plop," where three characters were living for a week as if it was the last week of their life. And they became complete monsters, you know. You can't really feel sorry for anyone in the film. Um, so it was written specifically for that. And taken out of that context, it's kind of a scary lyric, and a bit of a departure for me as a lyric writer. So I was quite pleased with it, in a good or bad way. And I suppose I think about different people every time I sing it. Although it's not exactly the way my mind works, you know? I think I swing, you know, I have bouts of ecstasy. I have bouts of feeling completely ecstatic, and really loved-up and positive. And you know, Utopian and optimistic. And that side of me comes out in songs like "Juxtapozed," which is grotesque in its upness and lift. And then I can speak myself completely in something like "No Sympathy."
NATN: Is the title track about space pollution?
GR: It's about all the rings of communication around the world. All the rings of pollution, and all the radioactivity that goes around. If you could visualize all the things we don't see, Earth could look like some kind of fucked-up Saturn. And that's the idea I have in my head -- surrounded by communication lines and traffic and debris thrown out of spaceships.
NATN: How did you guys hook up with Paul McCartney and John Cale for their guest spots on the record?
GR: We worked with Paul McCartney last year, on the sound collage, and we asked him if he'd return the favor, which he did. So that was a lot of fun. You can hear him in the third part of "Receptacle For The Respectable." And John Cale, he's a sort of childhood idol of mine, and one of the few Welsh speakers to have stood on an international stage. So he was in Cardiff, working on a film called "Beautiful Mistake," and we became his backing band for one song. And he sat in on one of our songs. So it was a sort of return deal with both cases.
NATN: What song is Cale on?
GR: He's on the "Presidential Suite." He plays a little piano. We actually approached him to arrange some strings for some of the songs. But he said he'd prefer to just play piano on it. But we approached Sean O'Hagan to arrange the strings on that particular song instead, which was very inspirational as well. He has a very unique approach. And most of the arrangements we did ourselves.
NATN: You have talked in the past about doing something like an all-techno album. Is that something you're still thinking of?
GR: We actually had an album recorded at one point. Well sort of demo-ed to an advanced stage. But we lost the discs. So we had to record another album, and then we found them, under a pile of records. So it's still in the can, and Cian is very prolific. He writes a lot of sort of instrumental pieces. And I keep writing all the time as well, so we have a large stockpile of songs and pieces of music, and hopefully they'll all see the light of day at some point. And our deal is structured with Sony so that we can release things independently as well. So nothing is going to be locked up in the Sony vault. And if something's not deemed acceptable for mass consumption, we'll release it ourselves.
NATN: You guys have had a very consistent and successful career. What do you make of the lesser reception Stateside?
GR: Yeah, I mean, we've enjoyed coming over so much, it's always been great. And the last two years, we've been able to release three albums and developed an audience in the States, which is small but very significant for us, you know? So we love coming over, and hopefully one day we can sort out some kind of record deal (laughs), so we could come over more often. It's a very inspiring place for us. We're obsessed by...most of the music we're obsessed by comes from America as well. So it would make a lot of sense if we came over more often. But um, you know, I'm sure it will happen.
NATN: Yeah, what sort of music have you been obsessing over lately?
GR: Um, I dunno. Lyrically, I've been listening to stuff like the Anti-Pop Consortium. You know, it's some amazing lyrics. Also a lot of things coming out of Wales, you know, which haven't even broke through in the U.K. yet, like M.C. Mabon. And I dunno, there's a lot of sort of independent hip-hop coming out in the U.K. at the moment which is quite distinct. It's quite exciting cuz it's sort of a change from guitar music, and lyrically it's far more progressive. I never remember what i'm listening to.
NATN: Do you think you'd want to put out another all-Welsh album?
GR: Well, it's my first language, and it's the first language of everyone in the band, so it's inevitable that we write in Welsh as much as English, you know? We've grown up in a bi-lingual society. I speak Welsh with my parents and English with another parent. You know, we speak Welsh together. It's something we speak every day, so it would be very strange if we didn't record more in Welsh.
NATN: Do you think it's somewhat of a struggle -- I know you have a lot of English-speaking fans, and say, is it tough to just think that these songs you record in Welsh wouldn't fit on a particular record, because you just switch languages part-way through?
GR: Well, with Mwng, it was a conscious decision to keep a batch of Welsh songs for an album, because they seemed to sit well together, and it would have been a shame to split them up. And our music's so disparate, it's good to find some kind of coherence to it. Anything helps to bring coherence to our albums, so it's quite easy to select a language and then record songs written in that language, at a particular time. Especially if the lyric dictates the melody, then we'll stick to the original language it was written in. But we have no rules, you know? This is how it's turned out so far, and who knows what we'll do next.
NATN: Are you planning to tour soon?
GR: Yes, we've been doing some sort of weekend events in the U.K., where we played a set of old songs in the afternoon, and we chose all the songs by lottery. We've recorded over a hundred songs now, and we had a list of 90 on the wall. And we had a cage of numbered balls, and whatever ball came up, we played that song. And we did another set as well at night. And I think we're going to take that to Japan and Europe as well. And hopefully the States. I think we'd like to do it like that in some of the bigger cities. But then I'm sure we'll be touring hard for the next year or so.
NATN: Were there any songs that were tough to do once you pulled them out of the bingo cage?
GR: Oh, absolutely. If we failed in our mission to play a song, whoever had the corresponding ticket -- cuz everybody was given a ticket on the way in -- won a mystery prize. Usually a large plastic spider. But I think we only gave away five prizes over the weekend. Or six. But it's pretty impossible to rehearse 90 songs, so we just tried as best as we could.
NATN: What was the one that stumped you the most?
GR: Um, there's a song called "Guacamole" that was pretty difficult. We remembered the middle-eight, so we just extended the middle-eight for like three minutes.
NATN: Are you running the web site for the new album?
GR: Yeah, there's a guy called Pie who runs our web site, and
he's built up the new site as well. He also designed the interface for the
DVD. So he built that all in Cardiff as well. In his house. So, it's a
pretty hands-on project. Now we have a team of people ready to make another
one.
TROY CARPENTER | Troy Carpenter founded NATN from a Chicago apartment during the ambitious winter of 1998 with co-conspirators Ben French and Jonathan Cohen. After a five-year stint in New York, he and wife Lourdes have recently relocated to Indianapolis, where he spends days listening to music and nights in the kitchen at Elements restaurant. Musical heroes: Jimi Hendrix, Bob Marley, Super Furry Animals. What else makes life worth living: Sushi, Phucty, runs in the park, and the Atlanta Braves.